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  #1  
Unread 03-15-2005, 03:34 PM
Lange Lange is offline
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Default Smallest Track Possible

Request for a Moab/Mortis-style track with the following changes:

1. Even smaller font (1 point less)
2. Get rid of the header/dead space
3. Transparent background and no frames
4. Use the Window Settings option for the following:
- Nothing: Do not show filters
- Frames: Show Con-Color Filter and Name Sort
- Frames and Titles: Show Con-Color Filter, Name Sort and PC/NPC Filter
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Unread 03-16-2005, 09:27 AM
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Unfortunately the filter controls are name and nesting dependant, so I doubt these can be made to use Title, Background or Frame option settings.

They could be hidden with buttons or mouseover events.
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Unread 03-16-2005, 10:49 AM
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Ahh well. Thanks for the reply.

If by hidden buttons you mean you can get those nested elements to make themselves completely transparent except on mouse-over, that would probably still be a huge improvement.

The main problem I'm having is losing all that realestate on the side of my screen. Track groups by con color and then* name - so one type of mob could be in more than one spot on the list. Because of this, at the times I need to have it open, I often have to have it stretched quite large already, so any little bit of space savings helps.
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Unread 03-16-2005, 11:30 AM
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I may dink with this in the future. I'm a ranger and I hardly ever use the thing beaucause it's so disturbing to my emertion factor. I hate to have anything on screen that is not needed...

What I had in mid would be very similar to what you were talking about.

It woud be a single lest on the left side of the screen.

Everythign would be transparent exect for the text names.
If you mouse over the top area it woudl bring up the varios menus, and

hopefuly I could make a version that auto hides, so the information is always there, if you just slid the window out with a button or something like the roll up windows that you aer seeing in mods now.

It will probably be a while before I get into that though, since it would take me a while.
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Unread 03-16-2005, 11:35 AM
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Yep, anything can be made invisible by default and visible only while your coursor is inside the window frame (or over some other thing in the window, or untill you click a button)

I suggest you screenshot your Track window, then use a paint program to color all the stuff you want invisble some obnoxious color, then post it here with some explaination of what you're after.

For example:
- Everything in Neon Pink should be invisible by default and visible when you mouseover any part of the window.

- Everything in Neon Green should be invisible until you mouseover the list area.
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Unread 03-16-2005, 01:46 PM
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Cool. I'll check back with this thread when I get home tonight and try to throw something together. It won't be til late but I'll get some kind of SS up.
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  #7  
Unread 03-16-2005, 03:07 PM
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Got a few questions before I start trying to piece things together that may not be possible..
- Can Drop down buttons (like the one labeled 'All' in the picture below) be resized?
- Can they be rotated vertically?
- Can OK/Cancel buttons be resized? Rotated?
- Can the Sort button be made vertical?



Unfortunately, I don't have any graphic editing software here at work so I won't be able to mock-up a copy until tonight/tomorrow night.

Anyway, verbally, here is what I'm thinking..

1. All function buttons should be made as small as possible (the drop down menu just has to say NPC/PC/All for example), rotated vertically and placed off to the side of the actual window like the color buttons are in the example below.


2. All buttons should be hidden.

3. As long as mouse scrolling works, the scroll bar should be removed entirely.

4. Because all buttons are vertical, the minimum size would be a thin, vertical strip showing, perhaps, just 3 letters of the mob's name. Both the height and the width would be expandable.

5. There would be a right-hand and a left-hand version to allow people to place the window on either side of their screen. The buttons will be invisible, so - unlike the picture above - they would sit on the right hand side of the window so that the text box can rest flush with the edge of the screen.

Last edited by Lange : 03-16-2005 at 03:11 PM.
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Unread 03-16-2005, 03:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lange
Got a few questions before I start trying to piece things together that may not be possible..
- Can Drop down buttons (like the one labeled 'All' in the picture below) be resized?
- Can they be rotated vertically?
- Can OK/Cancel buttons be resized? Rotated?
- Can the Sort button be made vertical?



Unfortunately, I don't have any graphic editing software here at work so I won't be able to mock-up a copy until tonight/tomorrow night.

Anyway, verbally, here is what I'm thinking..

1. All function buttons should be made as small as possible (the drop down menu just has to say NPC/PC/All for example), rotated vertically and placed off to the side of the actual window like the color buttons are in the example below.


2. All buttons should be hidden.

3. As long as mouse scrolling works, the scroll bar should be removed entirely.

4. Because all buttons are vertical, the minimum size would be a thin, vertical strip showing, perhaps, just 3 letters of the mob's name. Both the height and the width would be expandable.

5. There would be a right-hand and a left-hand version to allow people to place the window on either side of their screen. The buttons will be invisible, so - unlike the picture above - they would sit on the right hand side of the window so that the text box can rest flush with the edge of the screen.
I may play with this tonight. Since i want something similar.
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Unread 03-16-2005, 04:30 PM
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I'm planning on making mine to only show text when I'm tracking.

All the configuration stuff like the color buttons will be hidden or very small.
I won't be using the round buttons probably. I'll use something smaller.
As far as the dropdown box being vericle, I'm going to try to find the command for that box, and just pass the argument with a button, and get rid of the drop down box complete.

text with transparent background doesn't interferew with my imersion as all those color buttons and frames.
We will see what I can come up with.

i really do use this window much for the same reason I didn't use the emotes window. So maybe with a few tweaks I'll get to where I like to haev it on screen.
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Unread 03-16-2005, 04:47 PM
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I like the line AS SMALL AS POSSIBLE.

lol

One thing to consider that I can do.

I can make the buttons and text small, and make the re-size with hoverin and hover out methods.

Like my emotes mode, if you look carefully the text not only highlights but changes sizes, I also use this on my performance panel mods.

So the tracking list could be only names but if you hover over one of the specific names it could increase in size untill your mouse is no over it.
same with the buttons.

they could be enlarged. this way.

I think this would work well, because the the on hover over area could be set to much smaller than just setting that property for the whole page or section, or any other method. So they woudln't have to actually hide, they could just shrink when your not using those.
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  #11  
Unread 03-16-2005, 05:25 PM
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Go for it man. I'm stuck late at work tonight and have dinner plans right after. It's unlikely I'll get to PaintShop before tomorrow night but it sounds like we are on the same page / having the same issues.

I look forward to seeing what you come up with.
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  #12  
Unread 03-16-2005, 10:04 PM
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@Lange

I remember you from when I was first working on my tracking window. Did you ever try out the one that I attached to that thread using the smaller font? I wonder how small you want to go.
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  #13  
Unread 03-17-2005, 12:09 AM
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Not exactly what you'd asked for, but as close as I could get it, and certainly smaller than any other tracking window I've ever used.

Features:
  • Con checkboxes, Track button, Close button, and Filter dropdown autohide when the mouse isn't over the tracking window
  • Minimum height and width set to exactly match the minimum space needed by the window contents
  • Vertically-arrayed Con checkboxes
  • Smaller Track and Close buttons (renamed from OK and Cancel)
  • Smaller list font (Arial14 instead of Zapf15)

See attached screenshots for examples of the window in action at minimum and larger sizes with the mouse hovering over the window and without it. (Screenshots taken with frame and backdrop set to 0% normal, 100% mouseover)
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	TrackingLargeMouseout.jpg
Views:	270
Size:	124.8 KB
ID:	1883  Click image for larger version

Name:	TrackingLargeMouseover.jpg
Views:	276
Size:	112.6 KB
ID:	1884  Click image for larger version

Name:	TrackingSmallMouseout.jpg
Views:	254
Size:	31.4 KB
ID:	1885  Click image for larger version

Name:	TrackingSmallMouseover.jpg
Views:	267
Size:	40.8 KB
ID:	1886  
Attached Files
File Type: zip CompactTracking2.zip (1.8 KB, 256 views)
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  #14  
Unread 03-17-2005, 11:42 AM
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Yup, mortis. I've tried all of the tracking mods here and I love them all. I wouldn't have been able to live with the built-in track. Each and every one of them has 1-2 elements that the others don't that I love (small fonts, working transparency settings, shortened buttons, etc.). What I guess the request was for is one that combines all these elements.

The thing with this window is that the smallest functioning model possible (thinnest, especially) is probably the most useful. The window, when you need it, is one of those things that is open for the duration and is open all the way so that you can see everything near you. It sits on one side of the screen or the other and takes up the entire vertical portion of 1/6th to 1/5th of the total real estate. Worse, though, it's default is an opaque black that didn't accept standard window transparency settings IIRC.

Ger, your new window looks fantastic. It combines the transparency, font sizes and reduced button space with the new idea of hidden buttons. I love it and will download it tonight.

The only suggestion I would make is for two versions.. One with the hidden buttons on the left and one with them on the right so that the window can fit more naturally on either side of the screen.

EDIT: Actually, in thinking about this even if there were only one version it would still be better to have the color buttons on the right because of the way we read. Since we read left-to-right most people will probably put this window on the left due to word wrapping.

Thanks again for all the great modification, guys and especially this one! I think I have every UI window in the game tweaked in one way or another now.

Last edited by Lange : 03-17-2005 at 01:29 PM.
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  #15  
Unread 03-18-2005, 06:58 AM
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Default Kosmos Tracking Window

Now availble in the download section.

Thanks for the inspiration, I had been meaning to get around to this window as I am a ranger, and hardly ever use the track.

So now it's done!



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  #16  
Unread 03-18-2005, 08:55 AM
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Hehe, I whiped 1 up too
Here's a JPG with mouseover on left, mouseoff on right. I left a subtle tint on the scroll area to make the text stand out a bit more and so ya know where the dead space on your screen is (can't click there). Might drop the text a point size for final version.
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Name:	track.jpg
Views:	262
Size:	9.7 KB
ID:	1917  
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Unread 03-18-2005, 12:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lange
{snip} Ger, your new window looks fantastic. It combines the transparency, font sizes and reduced button space with the new idea of hidden buttons. I love it and will download it tonight.

The only suggestion I would make is for two versions.. One with the hidden buttons on the left and one with them on the right so that the window can fit more naturally on either side of the screen.

EDIT: Actually, in thinking about this even if there were only one version it would still be better to have the color buttons on the right because of the way we read. Since we read left-to-right most people will probably put this window on the left due to word wrapping.

Thanks again for all the great modification, guys and especially this one! I think I have every UI window in the game tweaked in one way or another now.
Good suggestion. Fixed an issue with the dropdown (it now scales correctly when the window is resized horizontally) and reposted the left-side controls version, as well as posting a right-side controls version for those that prefer it. They should be approved sometime today.
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Unread 03-18-2005, 02:03 PM
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Nice ger, thanks. I was just coming here to post about that sizing issue too. Basically, when I had the window really small (which looked great BTW) and tried to highlite a mob I wanted to track, it would sometimes scroll to the very bottom.
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Unread 03-19-2005, 09:41 AM
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Default FeedBack Please

So, when I get to working on this next, which features should I include?

Here's my list so far.

1. Top Button Panel will auto-hide and show with mouse over of the button panel area, but text will stay up as long as the tracking window is up.
This would give a picture like I posted above, but only the text.

2. Reduce font to Zapf14, or Chat-Font.
3. Attempt a OnHoverIn script to incearse the font size of the text of the selection you are hovered over. So as you go down the list with the mouse pointer, it would make the text for that selection bigger.

3. Include the NameHead sort function with a small button included on the button panel. I'll probably make this a single or double pixel underline of the button panel, that can be clicked on to sort the list.

4. Perhaps, include a 'tin't to the disabled filter buttons. I don't like that they are black when not being used, if you have a bunch of them turned off, you have to click them on and off to find the one you want, if you haven't memorized the position yet.

5. Maybe... Reverse everything for a right side screen verion. Text would be right justified, scroll bar on the rightside, baisicaly would be mirror image.

6. Personally I use the windows settings to have the bacnkground tint, if i need it. Is the background on the list needed? I took it out because I felt it was re-dundant, since the normal window background can now do the job, and the table backgoudn doesn't have any user controls.
At least this way the user can set it how the prefer.

So,
Any other suggestions?
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Unread 03-19-2005, 02:16 PM
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Dunno if it would be of nay use, but here is a file with Zapf10 that I made a while back.
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File Type: zip FontZapf10_0.zip (2.0 KB, 227 views)
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Unread 03-19-2005, 02:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mortis42
Dunno if it would be of nay use, but here is a file with Zapf10 that I made a while back.
Nice, thanks!
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Unread 03-20-2005, 07:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mortis42
Dunno if it would be of nay use, but here is a file with Zapf10 that I made a while back.
Do you have the .XML file for the font also?
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Unread 03-20-2005, 09:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kosmos
Do you have the .XML file for the font also?
Woops, sorry, forgot to put it in.
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File Type: zip FontZapf10_0.zip (3.1 KB, 210 views)
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Unread 03-20-2005, 10:16 AM
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Default What's Everybody Looking At????

Uploaded the new version of my tracking window.
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Name:	What.jpg
Views:	262
Size:	168.3 KB
ID:	1985  
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Unread 03-22-2005, 05:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mortis42
Woops, sorry, forgot to put it in.

I can't get this Zapf10 to work, it just shows garbage.
I'm 99% sure I've done everything right. I think the XML is messed up or something.
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